The Price Of Documentation: 1978 Cadillac Seville
In the collector world, we tend to put a lot of stock in documentation of a car’s originality and/or history, but how much monetary value does documentation add? The seller of this—admittedly very nice, very low mileage—1978 Cadillac Seville Elegante seems to be banking on the answer to my question being “a lot.” For this one-family owned car and its stacks of paperwork spanning from its pre-delivery inspection checklist from December 12, 1977 to today, enumerated here on craigslist—a car with a NADA “high retail” value of $4,925, and of course retail tends to be higher than private party—the El Cerrito, California seller is asking $19,995 (archived ad).
Two points in the seller’s defense: 1) that NADA value seems awfully low for one of the more historically significant cars of its era, and one that is fast increasing in recognition as a classic, and 2) this thing is pristine. I don’t think the asking price is entirely out of line, especially when the 18,998-mile odometer reading, backed up by, yes, documentation, is taken into consideration. The Elegante package, new for 1978, also adds a layer of desirability; its hallmarks are two-tone paint with a brightwork spear separating the upper and lower bodysides and, crucially, no padded vinyl roof, the better to accentuate the tailored, razor-edge styling of the first-generation Seville. I’m not as keen on the bumper moldings color-keyed to the Western Saddle Firemist paint, but it does add to the individuality expressed by the Elegante package.
Inside, the individual front seats wrapped in perforated leather, bisected by a lockable console, are a further highlight of the Elegante, and this caramel-colored driving room looks just as spectacular as the exterior, front and rear. Probably my favorite bit of original paraphernalia listed is the “Original 8 track Cadillac Demonstration tape.” I hope the 8-track player still works! Presumably it does; the only parts of the car specified as inop are the electric antenna and, presumably, the A/C.
Aside from the Elegante package, the original owner of this Seville eschewed the other major new-for-1978 option, a diesel V8. This is almost certainly to the car’s benefit (the two options appear to have been mutually exclusive anyway), although there was some grousing at the time that even the gas-engine Seville, the most expensive Cadillac this side of a Series 75 limousine, came with an Oldsmobile-built 350-cubic inch V8. In any event, the seller lists some maintenance that’s been done over the years and says that the car “runs and drives better than it looks”—no mean feat.
So we’ve come to the moment of reckoning. This Seville appears to be a very fine specimen, perhaps one of the best unrestored survivors left, with low mileage, single family ownership, and extensive documentation to back all that history up. I really feel that the NADA value is behind the curve—this isn’t the most expensive first-generation Seville I’ve seen, and prices across the board for these cars seem to be going nowhere but up—and if any car deserves to be at the top of the market, this is probably it. What do you think: is this Elegante’s asking price right where it should be, or is the seller out ahead of the market?
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Comments
I found two auction results of ’78 Sevilles for $16,500 and $23,500, so not out of the realm of possibility- but they had better get the air working to even ask that price. On the other hand, I ran across one on Hemmings where the owner had spent 80K building a supercharged restomod Seville with all the extras and wants 20K for his. As an investment, I’d buy this one, but to drive, the restomod sounds better.
It’s still ugly. You can put lipstick on a pig, but it’s still a pig, but it will still be a pig.
Exactly. A well-documented pig is still a pig.An amazing and iron-clad fact of the selling and buying equation is the seller always believes they are parting with the crown jewels.Many buyers disagree.
You’re out voted. When new, every car magazine review praised the clean styling.
Big deal. Show me a good- looking 1978 vehicle, especially a good-looking GM vehicle. We’ll wait.
I love that generation Seville, and that’s one nice car. Half that price, though.
No
It comes with “All of the maintenance documents that could be located.” As a non-statement, that ranks right up there with “ran when parked.”
NOOOO, the converted gas block diesel is not an advantage. It kills the whole deal.
“Eschew” means to avoid. This car does not have the diesel.
That is a pretty big alternator for a gas engine.
My 1981 Riviera with the diesel had two batteries.
I don’t see the other battery on this car.
Are we sure this is a diesel engine?
And why on earth would a gas tank cost $2000.00?
“2000 Approx . Replace fuel tank and fuel pump
(cannot find receipt)
Approx $ 2000.00”
I would love to have one of these cars. I am going to look at one soon. Picture above.
Here is the interior. Notice the horn pad has no cracks. He wants about $2000.00 USD for it.
There are still good cars for good prices out there.
Honestly this car looks like it needs a good clean up and not much else.
Did anybody notice the famous sprung headlights on this car.
I guess there is still work to do on this $20,000 diesel fixer upper.
I love these. I consider them delightful to drive and stylish. Once they fixed the sequencing problem (disable) of firing 8, 6, then 4 cyl for mpg, the 350 runs flawlessy.
This body style never had the 4-6-8 engine.
The only year they used it was 1981 and the body had changed by then.
These late’70’s Sevilles weren’t just dressed up Novas (on which they were based). They were fundamentally re-engineered to be proper Cadillacs, and the extra engineering was obvious. The ride was glass-smooth, there was little interior sound, rumble, or untoward vibration. It felt in every way like you would imagine a Cadillac to feel (unlike some of the other offerings, which were decidedly headed down the quality slope during those years).
My next door neighbor had one (white on white leather). She was a beautiful woman and looked just perfect driving that car in 1980’s Scottsdale, AZ. We were great friends.
One night she came over, knocking at my door rather hurriedly, with a sheer, chiffon swimsuit wrap over her tiny bikini, and asked me to get my swim trunks on and come over quickly.
This was not unusual for her, she was an eccentric German woman. We lived in a very nice area, and she raised turkeys and chickens.
So, I quickly changed and hustled over there, only to find her pointing at the largest bullfrog I have ever seen before or since (even in pictures), squatting on the top step of her pool. It looked almost alien in the shimmering light and blue water.
She said in a both stern and enticing voice (a talent this German beauty had long ago mastered): “Can you please get it?”… still pointing at it.
Well, I waded in and it bolted for deep water. I grabbed it in mid-stroke, and carried it out to the cool deck. I looked at her slightly puzzled – slightly annoyed, as the frog and I shed water, and asked her what she wanted done with it. She paused, then got her towel, and dried me from top to bottom, and said “We will have to return it”.
She motioned for me to follow a few paces to the garage, where she opened the shotgun door of her pristine Seville, then carefully folded the towel for me to sit on and placed it on the seat. Once ensconced, we drove to a park a few miles away, which had a small man-made lake.
I walked out as far as I really wanted to, and released the joyous animal, which gratefully hopped then swam off, never to be seen again.
As I walked back to the car, she said “Thank you, Bobby.” That was that.
That was a more-or-less typical evening with Lydia. German efficiency, and a big heart. We’re still friends, even though she lives in southern California, now.
The biggest frog I have ever seen got a regal ride with a stunning German beauty, in a Cadillac, back to nature (sort of).
There is no new car that can match the ride of these older Cadillacs. Now that I am of that certain age, I can understand why the cars that were aimed at the older crowd rode so well.
It is too bad there is nothing on the market for an older person anymore.
@Miguel – I know what you mean.
My current Jaguar, an XJ-6, seems to do the trick nicely. Superb ride, but handles well. Sadly; there are few cars like it any more.
The BBC powered Corvettes, 440 and 426 Hemi powered whatevers, and 390/427 powered Fords that I’ve owned all rode like lumber trucks (most handled about as well, too). I never used to mind it. Kinda liked it. Sorta like the kick from a .44 mag handgun or 30.06 rifle. Lets you know you’re alive.
But since I turned 65, I look more for a little rest for the old bones.
Gave you a thumbs up.
I have always driven Cadillacs and the like. Even at 16 years old I avoided the common cars, like Mustangs and Camaros, and went for luxury.
I always thought that if the car was good enough for the best of the best when it was new, and the car is now worth $500.00, I am going to take advantage of all that luxury.
I guess the world is catching up to me as 1972 Cadillacs are commanding high prices when a short time ago, you couldn’t give them away.
Also do you remember the signs at the Pick A Part yards?
A certain price, whatever it was, for any car, except Vegas and Ramblers.
Oh those Germans…*shakes head*. Good story though.
@tripowervette- no one would ever call You the biggest frog seen to receive a regal ride with a stunning German beauty … yuk yuk
@Wagon master – I’m sorry, but your incoherence leads me to believe that you are off your medication (or maybe on some).
Are these really the Chevy Malibu/Nova platforms underneath ? Cimarron’s uncle maybe.
A really nice $7500 car…. Basically a tarted up Nova/ Omega /Ventura /Apollo
( Note that the first letter of each name spells N.O.V.A. & adding Seville makes it N.O.V.A.S…)
A prime example of Roger B & the Beancounters “badge engineering.” The
main differences between the cars in this group is the trim, taillights, and the softness of the suspension or “wallow factor”. Basically similar to the difference between a Tahoe and an Escalade – substance vs. “style.” If someone does buy this, they should look into “agreed value” classic car insurance through Hagerty, Grundy, or one of the others (look in Hemmings),
because otherwise if some bozo hits you, you’re probably looking at having the car “totalled” based on the NADA or Kelly price…..another way the victim gets screwed by the lawyer/politician class. ” Agreed value ” means that your insurer will pay up to the amount of the policy to have your car repaired properly, if possible, or pay the agreed value if the car cannot be repaired.
Wow, its amazing how little you know about these.
Ummm…nowhere in the ad does it say it’s a diesel… But cool car non the less.
5K?
This puppy is begging to get a LS3 connect & cruise pkg…along with aggressive GT stance.Black with brushed chrome bits. Quilted red leather interior.Brushed aluminum 20″s. Thanx for keeping it in such pristine shape…that I need’nt worry about body work.
Are you sure you are posting on the correct car?
Why do any of that to a perfect original car?
The Elegante was a pricey option, too bad they didn’t go a step further and order the moonroof and digital dash to complete the bells and whistles. I had a ’78 that had split rear tail lights; top half amber for turn signals, bottom half red for brakes. I’ve never seen another one like that, the best explanation I’ve heard was that it must have been a Canadien spec car – never confirmed that though.
Canadian, thank you very much. Horrible body style. Just sayin’
Canadian, sorry!
I owned a ’78 Elegante in the day, and it was fitted with the moon roof. Unfortunately, that option lowers the interior head liner so much to accommodate the mechanism, that I had to sit leaning into the moon roof area with the sunshade retracted – and I’m just 6′ 2″! I liked the Trip Computer/digital dash, but the computer was not something you could safely manipulate while driving. Overall, the ’78 Seville was one of the best cars I’ve ever owned. What a joy to drive! And I loved the seat belt chime – real bells!
Apparently, you need to use less complex words than “eschewed.” People cannot seem to understand what you were saying. NO DIESEL.
I had a blue over blue Elegante, bought it in 89 for $1,500. It only had 39k on it at that time and I sold it 3 years later with 69k on it for $2,500. Nice driver, but thats about all you can say. Service wise, the air pump for the suspension went out ($$$$) so I replaced it with cut down coil overs to keep the ride height right (which is what sold the car – no air pump). I also had an insurance repaint due to a sandstorm. Any of my 60’s or 70’s (or 80-‘s) Jags saloons were/are better drivers…
No such thing as a blue over blue Elegante. You had your choice of black/silver and the mahogany/whatever as shown in this offering. That was it.
car must of been a special order then as it was Medium blue over Sterling blue with no vinyl and the chrome spear and Elegante markings. Had dark blue leather interior with medium blue carpet. Biggest reason we got rid of it was the Wife couldn’t handle (ok hated) all the different colors of blue. That and she didn’t want it to start with as she had found a tan 83 Eagle wagon she wanted…and I wanted the Seville. Ended up when we sold the Seville we bought an 84 Eagle wagon…in two tone blue…
I agree, they didn’t drive like the big Caddy’s…they were too heavy for the nova underpinning imo.
I must say, entertaining reading today…especially the frog and prince fable…
This example is obviously a gasoline engine–see the badge behind the front wheels labeling “Seville” and the rectangle below it says “Fuel Injection” in black lettering. On a diesel powered Seville of the era, that rectangular badge was smaller and the word “Diesel” written in red lettering. There is no such label on this one. It’s a great car–completely modified by the engineers from its Nova platform basis–yet retaining all the amenities of a Cadillac in a smaller package. The buying public “ate them up” when they were introduced! This is a magnificent survivor–only improved had it been equipped with the factory Astroroof. This one is for a collector, if he can get the price down a bit, all the better, but kept in show condition, it won’t depreciate! This one is Western Saddle Firemist on the lower color and Ruidoso Saddle on the upper color with Saddle Leather interior. This generation of Seville rides and handles quite nicely–especially for urban driving.
Article specifically says the OG owner eschewed (chose to avoid) the diesel.
I wish I could see the badge on the front fender. I went through all the pictures and I didn’t see a clear shot of it. How did you see that?
I’d rather have this Seville, then the bustle back monstrosity successors.
When you are driving them, they both look the same, but I know what you are saying.
Definition of eschew
transitive verb
: to avoid habitually especially on moral or practical grounds : shun
Size-wise, I would think this would be perfect. For those who want a Cadillac, but are reluctant to either spend the big bucks to buy a Fleetwood Brougham, or don’t want a huge boat on wheels, but want the style and elegance that comes with the Cadillac name. I remember when I first saw this generation Seville. I wasn’t very impressed with it.
The 350 isn’t Oldsmobile built. Cadillac actually bought the short block assembly from Oldsmobile and finished the engines and installed the Bendix fuel injection system on them, so they were sort of Cadillac engines in some way.
Cadillac put a good amount of time and engineering into the Sevilles, they moved the Eldorado assembly line into the “standard” Cadillac assembly line so that the Seville could be made at Cadillac main in Detroit.
Bob Lund was instrumental in the development of this car and told me his only regret was not being able to talk the bean counters into making it front wheel drive…stories he told me when I was used to cut his lawn…
In 1977 I and some friends from school in greater LA spent the 4th of July holiday weekend in the SF Bay area with a classmate. His parents had a new Seville, IIRC black with a silver leather interior. Has been 40 years, but what I do remember is that it was awesome compared to anything I had been in up to that point. The ride was very nice but not mushy, and for the time, the look was spectacular. It had the wire wheels like this one.
Great driving /looking car. It’s got an Olds 350 for power so it’s dead reliable. My friend had a twin to this he just sold. Don’t knock it until you tried it. Not boat handles great too.
too many cookies, and a diesel? Pass
Not a diesel. Specifically says the OG owner eschewed the diesel.
Goodness how many are going to MISREAD that this car has a diesel?
NO DIESEL IN THIS CAR FOLKS!
The alternator looks really big for a gas engine.
Caddy’s used huge alternators to handle demand for all the power options…100 amp maybe? They would really sing when used to jump another car….
These cars rode. drove and handles better than any other American sedan when introduced in 1975. The fit , finish and materials used were a step above anything Cadillac had offered before. My Grandfather bought one of the first ones produced, a white car with dark green padded roof and dark green leather. Shutting the door was like shutting a vault. Caddy had a lot riding on this car and it was a home run.
Yep.
Then GM killed it after a 4 year run, and replaced it with stinky garbage (I mean the 1980 so-called Seville). Ford did it after only 3 years with the Thunderbird. I don’t know why, but all large automakers seem to have a penchant for launching sweet new designs, then killing them and using the badge on one of their ‘ghastly’ lines (that’s the technical term for right-side of the sales bell curve, grotesque behemoths).
Makes you appreciate Zora Duntov all the more, huh?
Hello! And guess what!?!?! I am THE BUYER of this exact 78 Cadillac Seville Elegante. I Have been buying 70’s Cadillacs for decades and I am as critical as they come. I know these cars like the back of my hand. I remember well buying very nice first generation Sevilles for $3,000!!! Those days are gone. I found this car on Craigs list and I e-mailed the Seller and I received a call back the next day. I ask several questions and received all the right answers and within minutes negotiations started. We settled at $18,750 and I shipped the car enclosed to Southern California on a direct shipment. In my opinion you can’t replace originality and these Cadillacs are tough to reproduce in an exact original fashion. I was very pleased when the car arrived. It even has its original tires on it. The original paint is magnificant which is nearly impossible with the way GM was painting cars in the 70’s. The interior is flawless the padding and supple leather are just like I remember in the showroon when they were new and I was 7 years old! Just like the 911’s I missed the window…. the window in closing on these too. Just look…. they are gone and if you find one… it’s pricey. It’s a Cadillac “Standard of the World” It use to be “the” car for decades…. it is fantastic to see they are now getting recognized. To sum it up…. Ya, it was expensive but good luck finding another one like this!! GOOD LUCK!!! I am thrilled, just thrilled and the documentation is UNREAL!!! I found this article after my purchase… pretty funny!
Good for You!
I hope that you will have many years of enjoyment.
Congratulations! It’s a very beautiful car!