Not Your Father’s F-85: North American F-86 Sabre
Oldsmobile built its F-85 from 1961 to 1963. It shared the new Y-body platform with the Buick Special and Pontiac Tempest using a 112 inch wheelbase and unibody construction. If you really want to impress people, you could step up into a North American built F-86 Sabre. While close in nomenclature, these are two very different modes of transportation. Many thanks to JRHAELIG for bringing this to our attention. It is not often that an F-86 Sabre comes to market and this one is listed for sale here at Courtesy Aircraft Sales. The asking price is $179,000. This F-86F Sabre is located in Rockford, Illinois.
The jet is being sold as is and is said to be a very complete, nonoperation and unrestored example. It is currently painted in Bolivian Air Force camouflage. It was manufactured by North American Aviation in Inglewood, California and delivered to the US Air Force in April of 1953. At that time the Cold War was in full swing and the Korean War was coming to an end in the next three months. The F-86 Sabre played a major role as our front line fighter in the Korean Conflict.
The cockpit still has the proper gauges and seat but reflects years of neglect. The Sabre comes with a General Electric J-47 Turbojet engine which is not currently installed. Service records indicate that the F-86 Sabre was delivered to the 21st Fighter Bomber Wing at George AFB in California and then when on deployment to Alaska. Later, the plane was assigned to the 401st Fighter-Bomber Group in Alexandra, Louisiana and nine months later to the 322nd Fighter Day Wing at Foster AFB in Texas in 1954. In 1955, it was again moved to McClellan AFB in California before being sold or sent to Venezuela and then to Bolivia.
The F-86 Sabre is easily recognizable as the first swept wing jet powered fighter used by the US. The earliest jet fighter dogfights were between the F-86 Sabre and the Soviet MIG-15. Over 7,800 F-86 Sabres were built from 1949 to 1956. This F Model represents one of the last models of the F-86 and featured an upgraded engine. A total of 2,239 F-86F Sabres were produced.
Auctions Ending Soon
2006 Ford Mustang Saleen S281 SCBid Now16 hours$15,000
2002 Subaru Impreza WRXBid Now3 days$333
1975 Chevrolet Corvette ConvertibleBid Now3 days$3,000
1964 Ford F-100 Camper CustomBid Now3 days$2,000
2006 Jeep Wrangler SportBid Now5 days$10,500
Comments
My neighbors were less than impressed with the M3 Stuart that I had in my yard at one point, I can just imagine what they would think if I brought this home, lol.
I had a model of the F-85 Super Saber in the early 1970’s.
Whomever wins this sale is “Going to need a bigger trailer” to paraphrase Roy Scheider’s character in the movie “Jaws” in order to get this home.
Wins? This is not a auction, that is a set price.
I always thought this was a cool airplane. When I was in Viet Nam we were flying the F-100 Sabre ,which was the next generation and it was old then. We literally flew the wings off of them. I don’t go around pricing old fighter Jets, but the sell price seems like a Big, Big, number to me, even if it was Air Worthy. The cost to make this flyable and be able to afford to fly it, just seems totally un-realistic to me. I can’t imagine anyone that could do it or why they would want to.
Quite impressive to have this in your collection but two things cross my mind:
1/ How would I get it home?
2/ What would I do with it once I got it home?
For me this is one of those times when die-cast would win out over having the real thing. But I still have to say that it would’ve been quite an experience to have actually flown one…
The wings come off and transport it by truck. Nice winter restoration project, and in the mean time get jet qualified.
Are you seriously thinking that this could be made airworthy again?
What,,kick the tires, do a walk around and fly it home,,outlaw style,as if it would be that easy. David Gilmours “Ice is forming on the tips of my wings, I thought I thought of everything” comes to mind.
It’s sort of been done – https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/Came-Roost-Oregon-180969502/
I lived around the corner from this B17 Gas Station/Restaurant for years!
It’s sort of been done – https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/Came-Roost-Oregon-180969502/
I lived around the corner from this B17 Gas Station/Restaurant for years!
Or rather than diecast, you could get a framed picture of one and hang it up in the garage or room. In fact, I know of one at a local thrift store that I saw. Hmm, I wonder if it is still there? The odd thing about the picture of one that I saw was it had a Red star on the tail. Was there a Chinese version?
MIG-15, standard Russian Fighter of that time.
There is no option to reply to Paul’s log so I’ll reply to myself in lieu of Paul’s log. I went back to that thrift store, and bought the picture of the MIG-15. I bought it only because of this discussion thread. This F-86F and my picture of the MIG-15 (I suppose that’s what it is) look very similar with various degrees of differences like the MIG-15’s tail wings are up midway on the tail rudder; the guns up front on the MIG-15 look to be on the bottom front under the intake instead of side 50 cals like on the F86F. The intake of the MIG-15 is flat and round where the F-86F’s intake has the top portion protruding out somewhat. It’s amazing how two rivalries can have the same technology at the same time in history. But then again it’s not surprising.
I remember the old Oldsmobile advertisement “This is not your father’s Oldsmobile “
A F-86 Sabre crashed into a ice cream parlour Sacramento back in 1972, killing 12 children and 10 adults. The jet was a former Royal Canadian Air Force unit. It was one of two sold to the City of Oshawa where it was supposed to be made into a monument. To prevent it from ever flying, prior to sale it was stripped, with the main frame was cut. Crown Assets had a policy to Not sell such items to private buyers. They were only available to municipal/provincial governments as monuments.
In the mid-70s there was a junk-yard north of Toronto that had about a dozen F-86s, all cut up. I ended up with some instruments from one, which I still have.
The story goes a little murky as to exactly who was initially involved and how it got into private hands. The other F-86 sold to Oshawa is a monument, and it is still there, at the Oshawa Airport.It was ultimately restored (frame replaced) to a reported high standard, and passed inspections.
The investigation ruled out mechanical failure, and blamed the crash on the inexperienced pilot/owner.
Of interest, the Oshawa Airport was used in WW2 by Allied soldiers to get to the super-secret spy-training “Camp X”, at a former farm few miles away .
One of the students was Ian Fleming, who based his James Bond novels on the people he met and experience there.
It is also very close to the wartime GM plants. The apprentice spies would practice sneaking into the GM plants to steal fake plans, or place fake explosives. They used real explosives at Camp X, which is now a public park on Lake Ontario, and old grenades still turn up from time to time.
After school, they went for a drink at the Bond Hotel.
When the US started the CIA, they modelled their training after Camp X, and still call it “The Farm”.
If you are ever at the Oshawa Airport, check out The Ontario Regiment Museum beside the Airport. No velvet ropes there. They have a huge collection of running, driving, military vehicles. Many are/were genuine barn finds that were restored by the Museum volunteers.
Well, I’m just going to hold out for a Harrier. I can park it and fly it from my back yard. Just am not familiar if JET-A can be delivered to an urban residence.
And, you do not have to bother learning how to parallel park it…
I think it’s a possibility that 007’s surname was Bond because of the hotel that Ian Fleming and his cronies drank at. The F 86 Sabre and the early Supermarine Spitfire are the best looking aircraft ever to my mind.
I think the Bond name came from the author of a book about bird watching.
There are two theories on how Ian Fleming came up with the name James Bond:
One was the fact that Fleming and others regularly went for drinks at the Bond Hotel.
The second is that Fleming was staying at a home in Toronto, on Avenue Rd., and drove past St James-Bond United Church every day.
BTW there is no “Saint James Bond”. The St James and Bond Street Church amalgamated, hence the name.
I surely understand why they should not be sold to private parties. When I was in the Air Guard we had pilots who could not transition from a F84 to F100 because of the difference in speed. We also had pilots who could not handle the transition from a F100 to a F106. A F106 is a Mach 3 airplane. I read the F35 is the last manned plane because of pilots blacking out due to g force during certain maneuvers.
The F-106 was barely a Mach 2 and change. I was a weapons controller in the Air Force, and the Dagger was NORADs primary interceptor before the F-4 came out.
Seen one of these flying around about 20yrs ago. awesome looking plane, and let me tell you ..very loud.
Wowsers…One of the most beautiful early fighter jets. When I was a kid I built a model and always dreamed of this as the ultimate airplane. Pretty good price on this hard to find jet. But you aren’t going to move from a Cessna 152 to this, that is for sure. I’d rather have this than a P-51, and for 1/10th the price, it would give a huge amount of flying fun for the buck. It would require a good hangar at an airport with a long runway. And yearly proficiency training and significant annual inspections. And if you have the money to own it, I’m sure the very thristy fuel tag probably wouldn’t bother you much.
My speed is Quicksilver ultralights these days, but I can still get excited by even seeing one of these for sale. Thanks BF.
I seriously doubt you’ll find an airworthy P-51 for less than a couple of million dollars. There’s one for sale in Christchurch, NZ, for $2.4m, and in the UK there’s a dual seater (not dual control) for £1.8 Million ($2.4m)
Bob P,
That dual seat P-51 in the UK is probably the one I had the incredible luck of riding in about 30+ years ago.
I was visiting the Imperial War Museum at Duxford, watching as a dual seat P-51 and a couple of Spitfires were performing TNG’s on the grass field. I approached the P-51 after it landed, and struck up a conversation with the pilot. When he realized I was an American and both a Packard and Rolls-Royce owner, plus I was VERY familiar with the Packard & Rolls-Royce connection building aircraft engines during WW2, he asked if I had ever been up in a P-51. Of course my answer was NO, my flying was limited to a Skyhawk!
He said after the aircraft’s servicing and re-fueling he would be going up again, and if I was still there [and not eaten lunch] he would take me up for a quick flight! That quick 5 minute flight was the most incredible hour long [at least my memory of that flight feels like an hour today!] aircraft experience I have ever had, even to this day.
Only after we had returned to the ground and had further conversations, did I realize there were 2 different airplanes called “Skyhawk”. My version was also known as a Cessna 172, His was a British jet fighter! Whoops!
Thank-you again, Jack!
Korea,,,don’t get me started on that miserable $#ithole, it wasn’t entertaining like MASH portrayed,,we lost a LOT guys FOR NOTHING!! My ex-GF, who was not very “history savvy” bought a KIA and couldn’t understand why there was such hatred.
Amazing aircraft, I’d have to think ridiculously out of date for any combat, and a museum exhibit, or on a pole at the Knights of Columbus, is about it. I look at the cockpit and gaze at the instruments and think how difficult it must be to fly, but people looked at my semi cockpits and probably thought the same. The one thing I regret most in my life, is I never learned to fly, and at 67 on SS, it doesn’t look likely. War is hell, I can’t even believe in this day and age, countries still wage war on each other and the need to create war machines like this, but( and this is the most impartent port) a salute to this old bird, and the courageous pilots that flew it. I’m sure they didn’t enjoy what they did, but in the name of freedom, OUR FREEDOM, they did as they were told, and we can’t forget that, no matter how frivolous the engagement may seem.
Bolivian Air Force running old Sabres,,,nice,,
I do understand your sentiment, but if that’s your rationale for buying a car, you’re going to be walking because the U.S. has been involved in armed conflicts with every automotive producing country in the world (including itself) at one point or another in history.
Until pretty recently some of these old birds were still in service. In the article, they had been converted t remote fly, and one had malfunction that made it ineligible to land. Sent some air force trainees up with live ammo for some real training, and the operator told to make it hard on the trainees. That thing is so overbuilt, he did maneuvers with that old bird no one believed possible. At least that one went out ‘with his boots on’.
I’m curious why a Catholic, non-Military organization like the KofC would want to display a fighter jet???
Probably because a high percentage of members are former military. And while NOBODY hates war as much as a veteran, we also know that sometimes war is a necessity. Otherwise, you have evil like Hitler and Putin. And EVEN KofC members built model airplanes when they were young. 😁
As a 3rd degree member of the KofC, I thought the comment about a military plane being displayed as odd, thought I might be missing some sort of history. Turns out it was just a random comment.
Among the many car models I built, I managed to put together a couple of P51s.
My Uncle Steve flew not this, but an F-100 Super Sabre. I recall being in awe of him at the time. That was around 1960. He got lucky, missed the two big wars, Korea and Nam. (some of us not so lucky in that department, you are right about war, Howard) Later he snagged a job piloting for Pan Am. Those were the glory days of aviation, as far as airline jobs go. These days pilots are not the highly skilled and experienced ex military, something very different. Pilots are the same as anything else, you get what you pay for and airlines want profits, not experience. I have not flown in years, it scares me to get on a commercial plane.
What? Just because a person didn’t serve in the military but put in the hours to train and get certified, they are somewhat not qualified enough to do the job as well?
Yeah, with that attitude, best to stay home with your head in the sand and let the millions of others do really risky stuff like being an airline passenger.
You miss my point. In the military you put in thousands of hours in the air. In a commercial for profit flight school, I would think not. Modern jets are mostly automated, I understand that, but in times of emergency, I want a skilled person behind that control system that can at least draw on past experience to try and save the day. Did you ever listen to Captain Sullys testimony on Capital Hill about such concerns? Modern pilots are underpaid and over worked. That is a recipe for disaster.
Olds offered the F85 through the 1972 model year, then resurrected the nameplate in 1977 for the low-rent version of the X-body Omega.
Rigor Mortis, I agree totally, I was with a F-100 Squadron in Viet Nam. I also feel the same about flying Airlines ,as do most of my aviation friends.
Canada had the F-86 flying for 1967 our centennial year. They then became the Golden Hawks our air show team. We still have one flying up here in Canada , Chris Hatfield has had her in the sky. Good Airframe on her had 6- 50 Cals 3 on each side and will do if you can’t find a CF 104 Starfighter I happen to like the afterburner in the 104
My first flight after pilot training was in one of these in Chambley, France. Base was closing so just got a few fun flights before moving up to bigger and faster things. Afraid it’s out of my pocketbook range. Good old days.
Take the engine and sell it to someone wants to built a jet dragster. Put the plane on a pedestal in some park. I’ve worked on fighter planes. You think cars are expensive to restore. Bi-planes or fabric planes are the easy to restore and also expensive to restore. So I can’t imagine the cost to restore this plane. Plus its a fighter plane so think about all the G loads over the years along with hard landings.
Cool old jet, and should be on display at a local VFW for sure!!
Couldn’t agree more with Howard, it sucks for all participants. Maybe the people who start them, or even the ones who can’t figure out how to prevent wars, should have to endure it.
But that’s not a conversation for here.
I hope this old bird is at least put on display for future generations to see what sacrifices have been made and how far technology has progressed.
Would make great yard art. Would cost 6 if not 7 figures to restore to airworthy.
What would you do with this, sell it to the Ukrainian Air Force?
There is one on a pedestal at the entrance to the Clark county airport in Indiana..
Expect about $5000/hour in operating costs, which is much less than a top fuel dragster.
When I was living in Ecuador back in ’14, I was at a ” any reason for a parade” one afternoon. A flight of six of these blew over us. Very low altitude. They were so awesome looking, real throwbacks to my youth. And yeah…very loud!
The most beautiful jet ever made. Take it back to natural metal finish, add the checkerboard tail of the 51st FIW, Yellow ID bands and USAF insignia and it’s perfect. Unfortunately the HOA would frown on it in the front yard.
I would love one of these as a monument on my farm. Mounted in a take off position. A lot of money but way cheaper than a burnt , crushed Superbird. Morley
How many gallons to the mile?
227gpm
Vice Grip Garage.
Will it run and make it 617 miles home?
Aluminum body, independent suspension, mid-engine, loud exhaust, cammo paint, alloy wheels, old school tail fin, bucket seat… What’s not to love?
i think Chuck Yeager broke the sound barrier in one of these in a dive because in level flight they were not supersonic.
they use to make a sweet RC electric ducted fan version f86 but it was discontinued before i could grab one.
Does anyone even build and fly those anymore? That took some skill, never got around to trying it, but wish I had. Today you plop down to a Best Buy, lay a grand down on the check out area and a prebuilt drone that more or less flies itself is all yours. A ton of fun I am sure, but not the same experience as what once was. I have heard that the late great Roy Orbison had model aviation as one of his true loves and had a heart attack while doing it and that is what ended his life. At least he died doing what he loved, if we all could be so lucky.
i have a sweet redbull helicopter, but i haven’t bought the expensive transceiver for it yet.
i have a couple planes, but also never found the time and they never got finished……
Really? ….Nobody wants to put a LS in it?? That’s a pleasant change.
I agree with the others, display model only.
Ed H, you beat me to it. Give this to Derek Bieri and I guarn-damn-tee you he’d get home in it!
Thank you Howard A for posting the Youtube video and reminding us of the terrible truth behind these artifacts. I commend you.
Yeah that asking price is pretty steep. But where else are you going to find one? Just the corrosion INSP would be a nightmare on this thing. But if you can find the parts or fabricate them it could be made flyable. Think of all the WWII ACFT that still fly. This thing has steam gauges so that’s not hard.The controls are real cables or wires if ya like. Finding the seals and O-rings for everything might be daunting. Then you have to take the engine apart, inspect every piece of it and get it back together and put it in a test engine cell stand and run it up before it even gets back in the plane.
Now you have to inspect and repair the airframe after it has been depopulated of all bolt on parts. I know a few sheetmetal mechanics that could FAB damn near any piece it needed. Then you paint it up like you want it and put everything back together and do some ground runs. Where you are going to find a F-86 Maintenance Test Pilot I dunno.
It could made flyable if you could locate all the parts that are specific to the F-86. That would be the hard part. O-rings and seals do have expiration dates, but are common from one ACFT to the next so half would be easy to get.
But imagine being involved in the project and finding Veterans who worked on these ACFT as consultants to assist you in doing it right. You would watch an 80 year old man transition into a 20 year old in mere seconds a gleam would appear in their eyes as they time warped back to the day when what they did mattered. That alone might be worth the $$$$$$ and effort. Pilots are cool, But mechanics are cooler, without them Pilots would just stand around with cups of coffee making little weird hand gestures simulating dog fights they had been in. :-)
WHAT? No quarter-mile stats??
One on a stand at the airport in Walhalla, North Dakota – needs some TLC. If it doesn’t receive some refurbishing shortly it will go to the scrap heap – sad although there is some local movement to rescue it although legally it still belongs to Uncle Sam.
Yes, old warbirds are restored to fly again. About half way down this link is the collection of an Indianapolis auto dealer. Is he a relative, Jim Woods? A Sabre just as you described.
http://warbirdsandairshows.com/Airshows%202014/aopa-mtcomfort-2014.htm
Sorry to disagree with many of you, but the B-58 Hustler was the most beautiful aircraft ever flown (B-1, a close second). Back when Barry was president and Armed Forces were getting cut, there was a rumor the Air Force Museum in Dayton might have to close. I told the wife if it happened, we’d pour concrete pylons in the back yard and bring the Hustler from the museum here. Years later, got to see a Hustler at the old Chanute AFB museum disassembled and start on its way to its new home in California at Castle AFB museum.
Sorry, Bruce, the Lockheed P-80 Shooting Star was the first American jet fighter involved in jet to jet combat. From Wikipedia – “Shooting Stars first saw combat service in the Korean War, and were among the first aircraft to be involved in jet-versus-jet combat.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_P-80_Shooting_Star#Korean_War
The B-52 is the most gorgeous airplane that has ever hit the sky.
There is a F86D [ pointed nose with air intake below the nose] in Milton WV on a pylon
sales? You can always hope, pretty small market crowd.
60 yrs ago we had a 4 member syndicate that owned a low wing. Means U got it 1 wkend a mo. No 1 of us could afford it. That was back when wages more closely matched the rest of the economy.
Imagine owning this? Beyond that, imagine getting it in shape, passing all the requitrements to bring it back & fly?
But, yeah, like the junks I restomod, love to drive this~
I enjoyed 40 minute flight over Cape Cod several years ago in a B-17 named Fuddy Duddy. Those guys had it pretty bad back in the 40’s flying those planes.. Best 40 minutes of my life..
Hoisting P-40 “Warhawks” aboard USS Chenango at Pier 7, Norfolk, VA October 15, 1942 is a nice picture if you can find it.
Wow funny that you mentioned that! I actually had that black and white picture. It was about 16”x 12”. I had it hanging for a while on a wall in the house. I think that I gave it to a thrift store a couple of years ago.
I love air shows as much or more than car shows because of the sound of the engines and flight acrobatics of skilled pilots! I would love to see this air-worthy again someday at an air show!
F86 vs Porsche 917- Lee Majors in the 917, Burgess Meredith in the F86
The Last Chase